Monday, July 23, 2007

The Looming of Daftness

I read the Telegraph on the interview with the AB of York and I humbly come away scratching my head with utter disappointment in its tone and what appears to be an absence of clear thinking. His words seem to undermine Windsor and the theology behind the Covenant and I am confused as to why he would make such statements in the fragile situation we find ourselves in. Ecclesiologically, I have a number of issues with these statements and some of them seem a bit daft to be honest.

If the Covenant and Windsor (the only games in town in my opinion) are not given the freedom to take their course without making threatening comments from the Mother Church then it is dead in the water before it even begins. This sort of thing seems to be a dare to the GS Primates to take the step of boycotting Lambeth 08 if they want to be out of the Communion. It has complete disregard for the process that we have entered. It's the American church doing the harm, not these GS leaders. Does this come as an authoritative threat or is it simply ++Sentamu's personal opinion? A threat that strong towards the American church for its 2003 actions has never been made. This is not to even mention the recent ridiculous statement by the Abp of Armagh who said that schism is worse than heresy. What does that say about the Church Councils and the authority given them to determine heresy? Why then doesn't the Abp of Armagh rejoin Rome if that is his opinion because if he really believed it then he would be in sin to remain an Anglican? Maybe the next headline will read "The Abp of Armagh enrolls in RCIA classes to reunite the Anglican Church in Ireland with Rome."


Anonymous john scholasticus said...

As for 'reuniting the Anglican church in Ireland with Rome':

(1) the Church of Ireland PRECEDED the Anglican Church (St Columba, St Patrick, St Bridget et al.); (2) the Celtic Church was ALWAYS independent on Rome until the Council of Whitby (date escapes me), when they were strong-armed into capitulation to Rome. Not much authentic apostolic succession here. Note also that the Church of Ireland had women priests DECADES before the C of E.

Food for thought?

8:05 pm  
Anonymous Anonymous said...


You are seemingly confusing the issue with pastoral practice and treatment of those with whom you disagree. My conscience is very clear on the issue itself and if the Anglican Communion made a declaration that these present actions of TEC are in perfect accord with Holy Scripture then I would have to search my conscience about remaining an Anglican.

But, that does not mean I treat people who believe this to be right as if I despise them. Charity demands I love even my greatest enemies. So, my conscience is CLEAR John and my actions consistent with my conscience and pastoral practice.

Is there anything else I need to do?

9:03 pm  
Anonymous dafydd said...

"(2) the Celtic Church was ALWAYS independent on Rome until the Council of Whitby"

This version of history is a little discredited - and has been for many years (even as a patriotic Welshman I admit this).

It is any case irrelevant. The so-called "celtic churches" were never in schism, always in full communion with Rome and the other patriarchal sees, so Fr Jeffrey's argument still stands.

"Not much authentic apostolic succession here."

Ehh?? What does this mean? Is J.S. suggesting that "celtic" bishops were not in the apostolic succession?

10:07 am  

Post a Comment

<< Home

    O God, most glorious, most bountiful, accept, we humbly beseech thee, our praises and thanksgivings for thy holy Catholic Church, the mother of us all who bear the name of Christ; for the faith which it hath conveyed in safety to our time, and the mercies by which it hath enlarged and comforted the souls of men; for the virtues which it hath established upon earth, and the holy lives by which it glorifieth both the world and thee; to whom, O blessed Trinity (+), be ascribed all honour, might, majesty and dominion, now and for ever. Amen.
    --Bishop Lancelot Andrewes

Societas Sanctae Crucis

About Me

My Profile


  • To the Theotokos
  • My Parish Church
  • Taking Jesus to the Streets
  • The Angelus
  • Steel Family News
  • Anglicans For Life
  • My PHD Supervisor
  • Diocese of Durham
  • N.T. Wright Bishop of Durham
  • Bishop of Beverley FiF PEV
  • Forward in Faith
  • Religious of orthodox Tradition
  • Our Lady of Walsingham
  • Church of England
  • Church Times
  • C of E News
  • New Directions
  • Anglican Comm News Service
  • CaNN Classical Anglican News
  • Anglican Mainstream
  • Catholic World News
  • Zenit News
  • First Things
  • University of Durham
  • St. John's College
  • Touchstone: Mere Comments
  • American Chesterton Society
  • G.K. Chesterton
  • The "Colossal Genius"
  • C.S. Lewis
  • Dr. Marianne Dorman
  • Bishop Lancelot Andrewes
  • Theologia
  • The Paul Page
  • Renaissance Music
  • Wodehouse
  • Project Canterbury
  • Rosemary Pugh Books
  • Pusey House Oxford
  • Comm of the Resurrection
  • Anglicanism
  • Alexander Schmemann
  • Traditional-Anglican
  • Trushare Great Links
  • Books and Books
  • Paedocommunion
  • Summa Theologica
  • Didache
  • N.A.Patristics Society
  • Visit Olde World Family Heritage
  • Cardinal Newman Writings
  • EWTN
  • Vatican Library
  • Tune in to Ancient Faith Radio
  • Anglo-Catholic Central
  • Women for Faith and Family
  • Catholic Culture
  • Being better Dads.org
  • Anglicana Ecclesia
  • Catholic Societies

  • Mary:Grace and Hope in Christ
  • SSC England and Scotland
  • King Charles the Martyr
  • Catholic League Unitas
  • Catholic Union
  • Conf of the Blessed Sacrament
  • Society of Mary
  • Priests for Life
  • Anglican Blogs

  • TitusOneNine
  • Anthropax
  • Sacristan
  • Curate Repose
  • Whitehall
  • Apostolicity
  • The Patristic Anglican
  • All Too Common
  • Prydain
  • Thinking Anglicans
  • Drell's Descants
  • A-C Ruminations
  • emergent like slime
  • Open Thou our Lips
  • Haligweorc
  • The Confessing Reader
  • Dr. Leander Harding
  • Tex Anglican
  • St. George the Martyr
  • The Oxford Movement
  • Continuing Anglican
  • Wyclif.net
  • Third Mill. Catholic
  • Anglican Eucharistic Theol
  • Fr. Brian Douglas
  • RatherNot Blog
  • Full Homely Divinity
  • St.Peters London Docks Blog
  • In Hoc Signo Vinces
  • Anglican Wanderings
  • Timotheos Prologizes
  • Global South Anglican
  • Deaconess
  • Liturgical Links

  • 1549 Book of Common Prayer
  • 1550 Merbecke
  • 1559 Book of Common Prayer
  • 1570 Roman Mass
  • 1637 Scottish Prayer Book
  • 1662 English Prayer Book
  • 1718 Nonjurors Communion
  • 1928 Book of Common Prayer
  • 1962 Roman Mass
  • 1962 Roman Propers
  • 1969 Roman Mass
  • 1987 Anglican Use Mass
  • Pearcy Dearmer Everyman's History of the Prayer Book
  • The Liturgy of St. James
  • The Liturgy of St. Chrysostom
  • The Liturgy of St. Basil
  • Lectionary Central
  • Catholic Calendar
  • Common Prayer Calendar
  • The Roman Breviary
  • Anglican Breviary
  • Cantica Nova
  • The Music Makers
  • Catholic Liturgy Site
  • Directorium Anglicanum
  • Catholic Blogs

  • Numerous British Catholic Blogs
  • Carpe canum
  • Ignatius Insights
  • Ancient and Future Catholics
  • Catholic Pontificator
  • Random Thoughts
  • Fr. Newman's Web page
  • fides et ardor
  • St Paul Centre for Theology
  • Canterbury Tales
  • The Shrine of Holy Whapping
  • Sacramentum Vitae
  • Cardinal Schonborn
  • Pertinacious Papist
  • Ratzinger Online
  • The New Liturgical Movement
  • Scripture and Tradition
  • Against the Grain
  • Mark Shea
  • ad limina apostolorum
  • Dappled Things
  • Amy Welborn Old Blog
  • Amy Welborn New Blog
  • Catholic Catechism
  • Benedict Blog
  • Mike Aquilina
  • Libertas et Memoria
  • Video melior
  • Orthodox Blogs

  • Energies of the Trinity
  • Orthodoxy Today
  • Monachos
  • Onion Dome
  • This Is Life
  • Orthodoxie
  • Chrysostom Web Page
  • Society of Chrysostom
  • Cathedra Unitatis
  • Our Life in Christ
  • Orthodox Way
  • Exploring Orthodoxy
  • Everything Orthodox
  • Parish Web Sites

  • Durham Cathedral
  • St. Peters London Docks
  • St. Silas London
  • St. Mary Mag Middlesex
  • St. Augustine London
  • St. John the Evanglelist Berks
  • St. Pancras London
  • St. James the Great Darlington
  • St. Mary Bletchingley
  • St. James Paddington London
  • St. George Hanworth
  • St. Helens Auckland
  • St. Mary Magdalene Sunderland
  • Archives